P&C drink and review a hazy IPA from Three Stars Brewing called “No More Handshakes,” then discuss the current state of the lockdown.
The boys contrast the stated purpose of the lockdown vs. what people seemed to believe, and that contrast seems to be causing a lot of the current confusion.
Early on, there were a lot of things we didn’t know about the virus, so there has been a lot of confusion about how to respond to it. That’s most obvious in the changing narrative about masks — although now it’s pretty clear.
With 20-20 hindsight, it seems obvious we could have taken reasonable precautions and avoided the lockdown.
But some people love the lockdown. Who and why? The boys discuss.
And why keep the schools closed? Who’s in favor of that, and why? What does the education establishment get out of this?
Finally, what are the social costs of the lockdown?
You can download the file by right clicking on this link
I like the oranges bozo theory where it’s too dangerous to vote on one day, but it’s not too dangerous to send kids to school every weekday for months on end.
Funny how the Fox echo chamber was mocking Biden for saying Trump would try to delay the election and here orange bozo is tweeting just that.
Do it. Then either Pelosi or Grassley becomes prez when Trump’s term ends. I’d rather have either than orange bozo..
In other news, after attending Trump’s rally here in Tulsa, our gov got Covid and Herman Cain got it really bad. God have mercy on his soul.
QUOTE: And why keep the schools closed?
Maybe this is part of the reason why?
* A Mississippi school opened last week and now 116 have been quarantined.
* Despite following Covid-19 protocols, 3 Arizona teachers got infected and one died.
* More than 250 kids/teens tested positive for COVID-19 after attending a camp in Georgia.
* A Georgia school became national news because photos illustrated there was little-to-no social distancing nor masks in crowded hallways. Interestingly, the school indicated they couldn’t mandate some CDC Covid-19 school guidelines. But, they suspended the student for posting the picture. Seems the school was more concerned about protecting its image than students.
Having Covid-19 outbreaks was predictable…Helen Keller could have seen that coming! Now the question is, how severe will the consequences be? I hope I’m wrong, but if the pattern we’ve seen repeatedly follows then over the next couple of months we will be reading about increased cases, hospitalizations and deaths. “If” that happens, the truly sad part will be that it was avoidable.
School is important but so is public health. There has to be a way to balance the two. Yet, some act like this is all a “political hoax” (despite a 160,000+ Americans dead). The real question is, how many have to get sick and die before people realize this is not “business as usual” and behave differently?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QM3DT6Fdhkw
The Academy of Pediatrics and the Children’s Hospital Association indicated nearly 100,000 US children tested positive for Covid-19 during the last two weeks of July. In Georgia, the front-runner in lock down re-openings, seems to have over 900 people in school-related quarantines currently. As well, some Georgia, Indiana and other state schools closed shortly after reopening due to emerging outbreaks. Surprise, surprise!
Seems Florida’s Covid-19 cases in children has increased by 137% during the past month. The state’s health department reported 276 resident deaths Tuesday, surpassing the previous record of 257 on July 31. That day’s death toll set a record for most daily deaths for the fourth consecutive day. Seems the death rate has steadily increased since the state re-opened. Despite that, a Florida sheriff has now forbid his force and any visitors within their facilities from wearing mask .
Haven’t we seen this movie before? I’m hoping we can avoid having more experience the daunting and deadly end of this familiar plot. Could it be that with a contagious and deadly virus that we might want to consider doing things just a “bit” differently…instead of pretending it’s business as usual? After all, doing the same thing expecting different results is…insanity. Just a thought.
A big part of the problem is that everybody lives in their own world.
To one person, 100K children testing positive is a bad thing. To another, it’s almost irrelevant, since there are studies showing (1) that children handle this virus better than the regular flu, and (2) there are very few (some would say no) cases of children passing it to adults.
For example, some people focus on cases. I think cases is not a good metric. People in the ICU and deaths are good metrics. (But some even question the death statistics, since if you die while testing positive for COVID, you are listed as having died from COVID, even if the cause of death is clearly something else.)
Agreed, people are divided on their perception about the data…no surprise given our current climate. Yet, here’s what’s undeniable…people ARE getting sick and dying from this virus. Given that’s a fact, you’d think people wouldn’t mind enduring minor inconveniences (wearing masks, social distancing, washing hands) to help minimize unnecessary spread, illness and death. But, it seems some are more focused on “their” rights than how their behavior impacts others.
So, my question is, how many have to die before the data naysayers are willing to consider making adjustments for the good of others? Or will this familiar plot, with daunting and deadly consequences, continue ad nauseam? It’s sad to know that a 20-something youth was influenced to attend a Covid-19 party to find too late that it really wasn’t a hoax or harmless for people of his age group. His dying words were, “I think I made a mistake”. The same with veteran Rick Rose who said in April, “Let make this clear. I’m not buying a f—ing mask. I’ve made it this far by not buying into that damn hype”. Yet, by July, while struggling to breath he posted, ” I just want to feel good again”. Shortly after that he was dead. We’ve seen a similar story with Herman Cain who openly flouted virus prevention measures. Days after attending a political rally he was admitted to the hospital. A couple of weeks later…dead! The list goes on.
Again, we’ve seen this plot enough to know the process. The question is, what are we going to do about it? Will we continue to fight about the data? Will we continue to act like the virus is a “hoax” and go on with business as usual? Or, will we finally accept that this virus is a force to be reckoned with and try to collectively do what we can to minimize its spread and resulting deaths.
So your reasoning is that if there’s a minor inconvenience that saves lives, we should be willing to do it. Are you sure about that? How about a national 45 mph speed limit? That would save lots of lives.
I don’t mind wearing a mask in a store, but some people claim there are downsides to wearing masks. I don’t know if that’s true, but it’s not as if they’re just refusing to do something simple to save lives. That’s too simple of an answer.
Also, argument by anecdote is very weak. There’s no shortage of horrible stories about people dying for stupid reasons, or people regretting decisions. It’s not as if there’s always a right and a wrong decision. Often you just take your chances.
Why not, Crowhill? What’s wrong with minor inconveniences to save lives?
The point is, we have seen enough of this pattern to know that if we don’t change we will continue to perpetuate it…in some cases with deadly consequences. ISTM, if we were to collectively make some minor adjustments, we could lessen the spread and impact and “truly” have some semblance of normal again. Yet, it seems some are more interested in cursing the darkness than lighting a candle. Unfortunately, in this case, someone deciding to exercise “their” right could impact others who had no input into that choice…with the potential consequence being the loss of someone else’s life.
Thomas Sowell says there are no solutions, only tradeoffs.
When you say “minor inconvenience to save lives,” that sounds fine. But then the question becomes how minor and how many lives.
We could save a lot of lives by closing all swimming pools. Is that a minor inconvenience that saves lives? We could save a lot of lives by requiring everyone to take CPR. Etc.
Personally, I don’t mind wearing a mask. But is it a minor inconvenience for someone who has respiratory problems? I don’t know.
There is a big difference between temporary and permanent inconveniences. I think that any reasonable person could go along with not swimming in pools or driving somewhat slower for a few months until certain adjustments can be made. Of course there will be exceptions here and there. Someone might have a condition that keeps him or her from following the restrictions, but you shouldn’t discard safety measures just to accommodate a few individuals.
“Personally, I don’t mind wearing a mask. But is it a minor inconvenience for someone who has respiratory problems? I don’t know.”
I feel like this is like saying, “Personally, I don’t mind the ban on smoking. But, is it a major inconvenience for someone with lung cancer or emphysema?”
If someone has severe respiratory problems and can’t wear a mask, they probably ought not to be in public now. If they get infected, they’re most likely toast. If they have to go out in public, they probably should be in some kind of breathing apparatus like a mask with oxygen.
That’s just it…we aren’t talking about issues like closing pools or CPR. We are talking about taking reasonable measures in a situation that’s impacting lives globally…some being needlessly lost. So, we have a choice…we can continue to act like it doesn’t exist or we can make adjustments. My concern isn’t so much for those who act recklessly. It’s sad, but they are only getting what they asked for. Yet, those who didn’t ask for it, that’s another story.
QUOTE: Also, argument by anecdote is very weak.
Anecdotes support facts and can add strength to an argument. In this case, there’s more than anecdotes. We have a number of facts and a verifiable pattern resulting in over 161,000 recorded deaths and counting. There’s nothing weak about that.
What’s weak, is our current government’s leadership…especially since many of them were critical of the previous administration’s handling of the last US pandemic. You remember that one, right? The one that resulted in 11 total cases and 2 deaths.
QUOTE: There’s no shortage of horrible stories about people dying for stupid reasons, or people regretting decisions. It’s not as if there’s always a right and a wrong decision. Often you just take your chances.
Speaking of “taking chances”, why did Trump and Republicans cancel the RNC Florida rally? Why is the Governor’s mansion in Georgia still closed? Why don’t we see Texas Lt. Governor Patrick out and about in the bars, gyms and factories where there have been Covid-19 outbreaks? Wasn’t he the one that said, “some things are more important than life”? Why aren’t Senator Rick Scott’s grandchildren doing “in-person” school? Isn’t it interesting that Barron Trump’s private school will be using distance learning? Hmm, I thought the imperative was children MUST get back to school? Interestingly, these people don’t seem to be “taking chances” in the way they expect or encourage others. Shouldn’t they be leading by example?
That said, we do have some that have drank the Kool-aid, such as Herman Cain. He rolled the dice and lost, big time. Regrettably, he may have spread the virus to others and they may have continued spreading it. That’s the greatest tragedy in this situation…those people didn’t make that regrettable decision…but they may have suffer the same deadly consequences.
Everyone agrees that online security is important. Everyone agrees that an important part of that is good password management. But password rules have very little to do with good password management.
Back in July, VP Mike Pence, head of the WH Coronavirus Task Force said…”In recent days, the media has taken to sounding the alarm bells over a “second wave” of coronavirus infections. Such panic is overblown….the media has tried to scare the American people every step of the way, and these grim predictions of a second wave are no different.”
Today, four months later, the WH Coronavirus Task Force said…“There is now aggressive, unrelenting, expanding broad community spread across the country, reaching most counties, without evidence of improvement but rather, further deterioration. Current mitigation efforts are inadequate and must be increased to flatten the curve to sustain the health system for both Covid and non-Covid emergencies”. Wait!…I thought there wasn’t going to be a second wave?
Hmm…seems time has verified that the media was more accurate than the proclamation of VP Pence…the one that doesn’t consistently abide by the Taskforce’s and CDC’s guidelines. Maybe following his and Trump’s example was one of the reasons why the White House had become a Covid-19 hotspot…with the POTUS, WH Staff, VP Staff and now numerous Secret Service members having been infected.
Interestingly, Pence also expounded in July…“From the outset of this pandemic, the American people have stepped up and made great personal sacrifices to protect the health and safety of our nation. And it’s because of their embrace of social-distancing guidelines that all 50 states have begun to reopen in a safe and responsible manner.” Yet, around that same period, the Governor of South Dakota, in anticipation of a July 4 presidential celebration, proudly stated… “We told those folks that have concerns that they can stay home. But those who want to come and join us, we’ll be giving out free face masks if they choose to wear one, but we won’t be social distancing.” Hmm…so which was it…social distancing or not?
Well, one thing for sure, the Governor kept her word about no social distancing at the July 4 celebration and followed-up with authorizing the Sturgis Biker Rally (attended by nearly 500,000) and the annual State Fair. As expected, months later, SD has the distinct honor of being one the epicenters for the current Covid-19 surge…with cases, hospitalizations and deaths rising. I’m sure the governor must be proud, she got what she wanted. She got to keep her people “free” (as she proudly stated during a recent Trump rally). Even more astounding is some critically ill Covid-19 patients in South Dakota refuse to believe they have Covid-19 and are dying from it…they still think it’s a hoax. A nurse in SD shares her interactions with such patients….https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WicsWfTm1ZI
That said, people may place their confidence in politicians but one thing is for sure…no matter what, biology has the final say and wins…eventually…irrespective of any political alliance.